Tradition meets innovation at a multigenerational family pasta business

Read the transcript: Ninety Years of Noodles: Borgatti’s Ravioli & Egg Noodles on The Unshakeables

Ben Walter:

There are certain platitudes that get said so often in the business world, they can become a bit trite. But one I do like is it isn't the fittest that survive, it's the most adaptable. I actually think there may be something to that one.

Christopher Borgatti Sr.:

My father used to say if we had a snowstorm, it'd kill our business.

Ben Walter:

That's Christopher Borgatti Sr., proud third generation owner and operator of Borgatti's Ravioli & Egg Noodles in The Bronx. Borgatti's doors opened in 1935, and a snowstorm used to close the shop down for the day. Over the years, different things affected the company in different ways. Borgatti's was constantly in flux.

Christopher Borgatti Sr.:

There have been times when the cost of wheat shot up due to droughts, the eggs with bird flu, the families and their children moved on and moved out of there. But some of these businesses get bought by a big company, and they play around with recipes, and it's not the same anymore.

Ben Walter:

If almost 100 years in business have taught the Borgatti's anything, it's that you have to change with the times or go down trying. Welcome to The Unshakeables, from Chase for Business and Ruby Studio from iHeartMedia. I'm Ben Walter, CEO of Chase for Business. There's nothing small about the impact small businesses have on our country. Every day, I hear from owners who are not only fueling our economy, but also shaping the character of our communities. Yet too often, you tell us about the hurdles you face, regulatory red tape, access to capital, and the constant challenge of finding resources to grow. These aren't just headlines, they're your stories, and they matter deeply to us. We don't use The Unshakeables typically to talk about us. This podcast is about you, but it's important that we also bring to you important resources that may help. And in this case, I'd like to talk about JPMorgan Chase's recent American Dream Initiative, which is designed to help put the American dream back within reach for small business owners everywhere.

Through expanded capital and coaching, advocating for smart policies that matter to small businesses, and continuing to innovate around services that help small businesses run and grow, we plan to support

10 million small businesses over the next several years. To learn more about the American Dream Initiative, go to jpmorganchase.com/communities/america. One small business that, to me, fully encapsulates this idea of the American dream is our guest on the show today. We're heading to The Bronx in New York City to visit Borgatti's Ravioli & Egg Noodles.

Borgatti's opened its doors in 1935. America was in the depths of the Great Depression heading toward World War II. And even though it's a noodle shop, this is a small business built to survive. And to understand how, we have to go back a little further to the turn of the century. Between 1900 and 1915, more than 15 million people from all over the world immigrated to the US, including Christopher Borgatti's grandparents.

Christopher Borgatti Sr.:

Their names were Lindo and Maria. And my grandparents came as teenagers from Emilia-Romagna,

Italy.

Ben Walter:

And you may be thinking Ellis Island since we're here in New York, but they actually landed in Boston where they got married in 1907. Lindo's work with an Italian wholesaler took him to New York. They worked, raised their family, and settled in The Bronx. Then when Lindo and Maria were in their late 40s, they decided to open a shop.

Christopher Borgatti Sr.:

Because grandma had the recipe, something, I guess, growing up as an Italian little girl, learning how to make pasta. And as she got older, this was also a necessity in life, just to learn how to make food. So with the simple recipes she had, they decided to open up a shop to provide, I guess, a livelihood. They rented a store, which we still have.

Ben Walter:

Same place on Arthur Avenue.

Christopher Borgatti Sr.:

Yes, same place.

Ben Walter:

All of the Borgatti's were involved from the day the store opened in varying degrees. The older sons were already in careers, but they would help out with repairs. Their son, George, even made the first wooden molds they used for the ravioli, but it was Christopher's father, Mario, who would eventually take over the shop.

Christopher Borgatti Sr.:

My dad was 18 when the store opened. And my father used to tell customers once in a while, I mean, this was a business that was started on a shoestring.

Ben Walter:

On a shoestring, they still were able to make ravioli, two types. One with the ricotta cheese filling, the other with a meat filling, all using Maria's recipes. They made fresh egg noodle dough and sold it to the neighborhood.

Christopher Borgatti Sr.:

And like a hundred raviolis would set you back $1 when the store opened 90 years ago.

Ben Walter:

Back then, this was a neighborhood in transition. The Irish and German immigrants moved out, and the Italian Americans moved in.

Christopher Borgatti Sr.:

There was a lot of the Italians who were relocating from Lower Manhattan, and they were settling down in this area because they were working at the botanical gardens, the zoo, Fordham University, because they were helping to build because they were skilled masons and stone cutters. So this made being closer to work easier for them. They probably just felt like, "Hey, Italians, what do we eat? We eat pasta."

Ben Walter:

The neighborhood evolved into a true little Italy, and the cultures and customs of the old country came with them.

Christopher Borgatti Sr.:

You used to see Italians all the time, shopping and attending church across the street. Especially during the summers, they used to have two feasts one, in honor of St. Anthony, one in honor of Lady of Mount Carmel which is the parish. So the streets were just full of the Italians being entertained by music, the food, and of course the neighborhood did change, obviously.

Ben Walter:

Over the next few decades, Borgatti’s changed with the neighborhood. They got a new storefront in the 1950s when the family absorbed the hat shop next door. Some of the businesses owned by other families for generations got new owners, and the Italian families started to move out.

Christopher Borgatti Sr.:

Not that there was anything wrong with the neighborhood, but maybe because apartments are small and they just needed to expand and have a little more room. Like all neighborhoods as one ethnic group moves out, another will come and replace them, and the journey just begins for them.

Ben Walter:

During the 1970s, Christopher picked up work at the store during the summers. He started with easy jobs, cleaning, measuring out flour for different doughs. He would also put cornmeal on the ravioli boards.

Christopher Borgatti Sr.:

The way the ravioli machine operates is, in the back part, there are these wooden boards that get dust with cornmeal. Because as these boards are put on a conveyor belt, it's going to be fed into the ravioli machine. And then as the raviolis come off the machine on a belt, they get cut by the person operating the ravioli machine. So this way, the person operating the ravioli machine doesn't have to go to the back, put the board into the machine. So it was almost like a meaningless job for someone just to stand there and put the cornmeal on it.

Ben Walter:

But it kept him busy and out of trouble. At the end of that first day full of flowering and corn-mealing and sweeping, he got an envelope.

Christopher Borgatti Sr.:

I opened it up and there were two 50 cent Kennedy heads as my pay for that day. I didn't keep them. I wish I did. Maybe they'd be like a keepsake, the first dollar I ever made at the store.

Ben Walter:

A few years later, Christopher joined full-time.

Christopher Borgatti Sr.:

1976, 18-year-old kid and a lot of energy. When I first came here, I didn't have the head for school. My education was being here, being with my father, my aunts, and those who I worked with. It's like, you think of back in the day with the apprentice, learning a trade. You're like the blacksmith or the carpenter, you're learning about it hands-on. You're not being taught about it in a book. So I think that was the best formula for me to learn. I had confidence in myself in so far as doing what I had to do here.

Ben Walter:

In those early days, Christopher was focused on learning, not leading.

Christopher Borgatti Sr.:

I was there to more or less support and help my father at the time. I never really challenged him with any ideas on doing things different. I just wanted to be able to support and help him. And as he got older and he got to a point where his health was changing, I didn't just want to take it away from him. But there was a time when he did slow it down, that was time for me to step up and be more responsible.

Ben Walter:

Time went on, and a few other things changed as Christopher worked at the store.

Christopher Borgatti Jr.:

He met my mom while he was working here. She was working at a pharmacy across the street. One thing led to another, and me and my sister come around.

Ben Walter:

That's Christopher Borgatti Jr. We have Christopher Sr and Christopher Jr. So we're going to call the younger one Junior going forward just to keep things easy. He was always at the store.

Christopher Borgatti Jr.:

Probably since I was a baby, I don't remember that far back, but I do remember my dad would fill a ravioli box with cornmeal and I'd be able to drive my Tonka truck around in it. Me and my sister both, we would hang out upstairs in one of the apartments, that TV had Disney Channel, so we'd be there. And we'd be intercom-ing downstairs to tell our parents like, "Oh, we want coloring books. Oh, we want this. Oh, we want that." They're like, "We're busy." I was growing up around the store, growing up around machines, growing up around my family. That would lead to me and my sister helping during holidays, Christmas rushes. Everyone's like, "What are you doing over Christmas break? Are you going here? Are you going there? Are you going on vacation?" It's like, "No, I'm working the ravioli counter."

Ben Walter:

Christmas, of course, is the Holy Grail sales season for retailers, and Borgatti is no exception.

Christopher Borgatti Sr.:

You always hear the customer coming in and saying, "I've been coming to Borgatti's for the last 20 Christmases, and I bring my children." And you hear the stories about the children used to come, and now they're coming with their children. So it just became like a family tradition. This creates a nice flow of customers who come to shop in this area during the holiday seasons.

Christopher Borgatti Jr.:

We go into overdrive those months. We're doing three months worth of production in two weeks when it comes to ravioli. So it's like the machines don't stop, his pasta machine doesn't stop. It's a completely different beast, but you anticipate it every year and you got to perform.

Ben Walter:

What if something breaks? I mean, you fix it?

Christopher Borgatti Jr.:

It has happened.

Ben Walter:

Now, I think we should talk a little bit about ravioli and noodle machines. These are large industrial kitchen appliances, not your tabletop mixer or pasta maker from Williams Sonoma. It's smaller than a car, but bigger than a pretty good size photocopier.

Christopher Borgatti Jr.:

It's smaller than a small car. It's not wide, but it's long. It's like average dining room table size. I could feed maybe six people.

Ben Walter:

Okay. So it's still not, you don't just pick it up with one hand. Yeah.

Christopher Borgatti Jr.:

No, you don't just pick it up and move it around. No.

Christopher Borgatti Sr.:

And in order to transport it, you can't throw it in the back of a station wagon.

Ben Walter:

Right. In the past, Christopher's Uncle George could come by and do most of the repairs, or Christopher would troubleshoot. But if it's a bigger issue, that means mechanic or worse. The machine has to be repaired by the manufacturer. And of course, the worst time for that to happen would be during the holiday rush.

Christopher Borgatti Sr.:

It was a machine that makes large ravioli. It was going into the holiday season, and there was a part on it that broke. And it was a situation where he needed to get it to the shop because it had to take the ravioli machine apart, basically, in order to correct something.

Ben Walter:

And this is in the middle of the holiday rush where you need all hands on deck? Okay.

Christopher Borgatti Jr.:

Mm-hmm.

Christopher Borgatti Sr.:

Yeah, absolutely.

Ben Walter:

All machines on deck.

Christopher Borgatti Sr.:

Especially, with the large ravioli.

Christopher Borgatti Jr.:

They're the headliners.

Ben Walter:

This machine in particular was a backup machine they were using for the season. Their original was with the manufacturer in Pennsylvania getting rebuilt.

Christopher Borgatti Sr.:

So as I'm working with this machine, I heard something happening. I heard a noise. It was making a squelching sound. And next thing I know, you got to imagine like there's two steel rollers that are parallel to each other that-

Ben Walter:

That run the dough through, yeah.

Christopher Borgatti Sr.:

Yep. And all of a sudden the roller drop, meaning like you don't see it but it's inside the machine. The sides of the roller, the shaft of it, there's bushings that it sits in.

Ben Walter:

I did Google bushing. TLDR, it's a small piece of rubber that helps reduce noise and friction in metal machines and helps the parts move. Think of the suspension on your car, it's like that, but this one was in a ravioli machine.

Christopher Borgatti Sr.:

So what happened was this part of the machine wasn't getting the grease because there's grease caps.

Ben Walter:

Sure.

Christopher Borgatti Sr.:

And it heated up and it was disintegrating the bushing, and that's what made the roller drop. Now, the rollers aren't aligned, and here I am trying to make dough straight and I was beside myself. It seemed to be I was throwing out more wasted pasta in order to make pasta. It was a nightmare.

Ben Walter:

Ravioli production was at a standstill, the line was out the door. And when you're a store called Borgatti's ravioli, you have to have ravioli. Like every good neighborhood shop, they got by with a little help from their friends.

Christopher Borgatti Sr.:

My wife reached out to her brother who's got an autobody business. And believe it or not, then he sent over a flatbed tow truck for this machine. It was funny to see a ravioli machine on top of the flatbed, and it was trucked down to New Jersey. We got it back in a couple of days, but it was needed to go to the shop in order to fix this.

Ben Walter:

Do you remember this?

Christopher Borgatti Jr.:

Partially. I was a little young, but my mom said people were coming up to the counter and like, "Oh, I need 10 pounds of lasagna." And she would just look at the machine and look at them. She's like, "I don't know what to do for you."

Ben Walter:

But one machine down for not that long can cost you a lot of money.

Christopher Borgatti Jr.:

Oh, yeah.

Christopher Borgatti Sr.:

Absolutely, yes.

Christopher Borgatti Jr.:

Especially that week.

Christopher Borgatti Sr.:

We told the customers what happened. Most of them understood. Others say, "You know what? Let me take this small ravioli." Or they said, "I'll come back later in the week to get the large ravioli." Christopher

Borgatti Jr.:

Yeah. Our customers are really dedicated to us, especially when something like that happens, they'll come back. They'll come wait online at 3:00 A.M. before the store even opens because they're like, "I got to get these things. I don't want you to run out." I think that's part of what being a small business is, you get to know all your customers really well. So when you go through something like this, it's not so much you're losing out. It's going to be tough, it's going to affect those things, but your customers have your back in a sense. They'll be back the next day if you run out, or if you have to close or something happens to a machine.

Ben Walter:

Kathleen, let's pause here because there's already so much to talk about. And I think we should stop and note, it's the 250th anniversary of the country, and we keep thinking about the idea of these national treasures. These businesses that have been here for decades, some of them over a century, and this is one of them. I mean, it is the fabric of an iconic American neighborhood.

Kathleen:

To be in existence for a third of our country's history, over a third. I mean, you're the numbers guy, but doesn't that ability to survive for that long just feel statistically exceptional?

Ben Walter:

I mean, first of all, they started in the Depression. They survived however many recessions. They survived 09/11. They survived the housing meltdown. They survived COVID. They've survived all this stuff with a single store in The Bronx. That's remarkable.

Kathleen:

Single store and single product. I love the idea of this just being one single thing. I always say to people, kiss, keep it stupid, simple. Just become radically good at one thing.

Ben Walter:

You're nicer than I might say, keep it simple, stupid.

Kathleen:

But it's so true. I mean, there's so much diversification, and then you can't tell what's working. Is it this? Is it that? I think a lot about Japan, and I love the art of the craft there too. They're really exporting perfectionism, whether it's knives or sake.

Ben Walter:

Sure.

Kathleen:

And I think here in this country too, we have such powerful stories of that, or someone just really doubles down and perfects a craft. And this felt like that to me. It filled me with an immense sense of pride.

Ben Walter:

Yeah. I think it's important that I describe this neighborhood to you. Have you been, Kathleen, to Arthur Avenue?

Kathleen:

No. You know what's funny? Growing up, because I grew up north of New York City and I had some Italian friends where it was the tradition to go. And I always hoped I'd be invited, but I never was. So you walk me through it as if I'm going.

Ben Walter:

You'll have to come next time you're here because it's really amazing. It's a couple of blocks and there's a ton of Italian restaurants and there's a really well-known butcher. There's a terrific cheese shop, they make the mozzarella from scratch. Every day, you watch them pulling it. There's a bakery that does really traditional Italian baked goods. There's a couple of legit Italian delis. The kind of place you walk in, they're like, "You want the matzo or the brioche. It's some of the best traditional Italian food in the city." My wife and I will go have dinner there with friends. It's really fun to go there.

Kathleen:

When you do your family trip, I want to tag along.

Ben Walter:

Yes.

Kathleen:

The strange family plus one.

Ben Walter:

Well, you're always welcome to join us, Kathleen. Now let's get back to the story and to Chris, but not Chris Sr., Chris Jr., who will continue to call Junior, followed the same path of his father and grandfather, and took up the apron full-time at the shop when he was 18. He'd already grown up in the shop, so it was really just a matter of formalizing things.

Christopher Borgatti Jr.:

About my sophomore year of college, that's when I was trying to figure out what exactly I wanted to do. And I was going for business school and I was trying accounting, I was trying different entrepreneurial programs, but nothing really made me happy deep down. But being at the store had always made me happy. So I was helping out there weekends and stuff. And slowly it was just like, you know what? If I'm going to do it, I'm going to go full bore into it. I still wanted to get my education, so I started to do night school and I would help out at the store more, especially helping my mom grow our online shipping.

Ben Walter:

Joan had started Borgatti's online shipping business two years prior. Each year, it grew. Even still, Chris Sr. wasn't sure about it in the beginning.

Christopher Borgatti Sr.:

Someone used to say to me, "How come you don't ship your raviolis?" And I was old school, so I used to say, "Well, if I start shipping my raviolis and they come to your doorstep, I'm not going to get to see you anymore." I felt like when you come to the neighborhood, you help sustain the neighborhood, shopping here and shopping at the other businesses. So if people aren't showing up anymore to the neighborhood, what happens to the neighborhood? I'm old school, okay? And I do what I have to do here.

Ben Walter:

But Joan was a computer teacher. She understood the power of the internet, and she insisted that Borgatti’s had to be online if it wanted to survive another 90 years.

Christopher Borgatti Sr.:

It was a learning process.

Christopher Borgatti Jr.:

And starting with that, it was always extremely expensive because there's so much weight with the raviolis and ice. If you bought $40 a ravioli, you're spending $80 to ship. So what I helped figure out, especially with the shippers we were using at the time is they have these flat rate boxes, so if it fits in the box, it ships for a flat rate.

Ben Walter:

The shipping now sorted. They fully built out their website to add an online store.

Christopher Borgatti Jr.:

And that's when Liz came on.

Ben Walter:

Liz is Christopher's daughter, junior’s sister, AKA fourth generation Borgatti.

Christopher Borgatti Jr.:

She's like, "Let's grow our social media. That's very important."

Ben Walter:

Sure.

Christopher Borgatti Jr.:

When TikTok first came out, she's like, "I got to get us on TikTok." She has her ear to the ground on all that stuff. When there's a trend that comes out, she'll be like, "All right, who's going to be in this video?"

It's usually my dad. He gets a lot more views than anybody. There's a good one where he's yelling about, "They said snow in the forecast, got to get your ravs and cavs," for the ravioli and the cavatelli. That's always a hit when it snows.

Ben Walter:

And when customers figured out they could order online, the Borgattis were really cooking with gas, and they did order a lot. Whether that was to avoid snow or a few years ago, avoid other people.

Christopher Borgatti Jr.:

I'm going back to a specific time with COVID, and the front of the store at this point was limiting how many people we could bring in. That was when online shopping, I think, jumped for everybody. And I tell my mom all the time, you were ahead on this because we had been shipping that point four years, I think. So we knew what we were doing. We had the system set up, so we were able to keep up with this huge boom of orders.

Ben Walter:

How much pasta do you sell in a week?

Christopher Borgatti Jr.:

It depends on the week.

Christopher Borgatti Sr.:

With many of the restaurants, like 20, 30 pounds of tagliatelle noodle for them, raviolis, they may be getting 5 to 10 boxes.

Ben Walter:

And that's 5 to 10 boxes of 100 ravioli per box. You can do that math.

Christopher Borgatti Sr.:

And these are standard orders every week.

Christopher Borgatti Jr.:

I would still say we're like 60 to 70% retail, but a good portion now has gone to our online shipping, especially a lot of our older and former customers have moved away. They're living in Florida now, the Carolinas, California. So we ship to all of them. And now we have customers who've never even been to New York, but they order us every month.

Ben Walter:

So this thing that Christopher was worried about, shipping, has not only not ruined the neighborhood, it's expanded the neighborhood. Everyone from The Bronx to LA to Miami is now part of the larger Arthur Avenue crowd.

Christopher Borgatti Jr.:

Now, I think the next thing we're breaking into is our wholesaling, and that's where we're trying to grow next. We realize people love to shop locally, and there's a lot of really good supermarkets, delis, and other places that they shop. And these are the places we want to be in. I want to be in everyone's neighborhood shop, not just in my own neighborhood shop.

Kathleen:

Ben, you know this is my jam so I’m going to take this one from here. I think you’ll be ok with me unpacking this one.

Ben Walter:

You're a marketing expert, I am not. They're marketing sort of a very old school business, both old school in what they do in old school and how long they've been around. On all these very modern marketing platforms like TikTok, how do we think about that?

Kathleen:

So when you look at what customers know and love, eight out of 10 customers actually prefer brands that have the sense of heritage and nostalgia and are older. There's so much that can be done when you are in that position instead of trying to be what you're not, doubling down on what you are, which is what they're using in social media. And interestingly, which most people would not expect, it's our Gen Z and our younger folks who love this the most. So we heard Chris Sr. talking about he's doing the best on the TikToks who's resonating with that audience. That platform's a predominantly younger skewing audience, and everyone's trying to keep up with the times and have relevant memes. But I would say, forget all that. Don't try to post Bad Bunny from the Super Bowl. If you are in the fortunate position of being one of these older businesses, double down on that.

Ben Walter:

Great, thanks.

Kathleen:

And now I have a question for you two it's about the price of food. It's all over the news. So how are you handling that?

Christopher Borgatti Sr.:

Just to give you an idea, the cost for the six tubs of eggs was $112. When the bird flu occurred and the price of eggs went through the roof, one 30 pound container of egg cost me $120.

Ben Walter:

How do you deal with the price fluctuations, and what do you do?

Christopher Borgatti Jr.:

We ate it.

Christopher Borgatti Sr.:

We ate it. And you know what? We didn't cut down on the amount of egg we used saying, "Oh, okay, let's drop the eggs a pound of batch because then we'll be saving..." No, that's not what Borgatti says.

Christopher Borgatti Jr.:

Yeah.

Ben Walter:

And how about real estate, do you own the building?

Christopher Borgatti Sr.:

Actually, we do. I think it was in the early 1980s, my father and the gentleman with the other business, which is in the building as well, bought it. And the property was being sold by a couple of guys who drove taxi cabs who owned it. And it was not to invest in property, he just bought it in order to protect the business.

Ben Walter:

He controlled his destiny.

Christopher Borgatti Sr.:

Yeah, absolutely.

Christopher Borgatti Jr.:

Was it one of the original owners of the building, wasn't their name Ravioli?

Christopher Borgatti Sr.:

Okay, that would be Mary Ravioli. So when the store was in the early parts, she was the owner of the building before these two gentlemen owned it, but her name was Mary Ravioli.

Ben Walter:

That is awesome.

Christopher Borgatti Sr.:

It's too much.

Ben Walter:

The circle of life, or maybe the circle of ravioli. But as Christopher hinted at, the Borgattis don't see themselves as entrepreneurs or landlords. They see themselves as stewards of pasta with quality customer service and original recipes that haven't changed for 90 years as the world keeps turning around them.

Christopher Borgatti Sr.:

I think of myself as a guardian of this business that my grandparents started, and that my father worked many years doing like a continuation of this story. Yeah, I'm a pasta maker who loves what I do. I love the fact that I got to work with aunts and uncles, and especially my father. And now, I have this dream of working with my wife and children. And I think of my grandparents, husband and wife working together. My wife, Joan and I are working together, and our children involved. And it's like, does it get any better than that when you think of a story that Lindo and Maria started 90 years ago? It's amazing.

Ben Walter:

That is amazing.

Christopher Borgatti Jr.:

I got to remind myself every now and then, it's like, we have pictures of them in the store and look at them, and I say, "I hope we're doing a good job."

Ben Walter:

Okay. Kathleen, let's bring you in one more time.

Kathleen:

This story is just so rich and It's full of everything we like to talk about on The Unshakeables.

Ben Walter:

They both talked about themselves as guardian of something bigger than themselves. I'm sure they do fine. I'm sure they make a living, but that's only part of what it is for them.

Kathleen:

I think that permeates all aspects of the business, wanting to make sure even with the cost of goods going up and inflation, these very nominal price increases. The essence of that is about being a guardian of your customer and your customer's pocketbook too, and taking that responsibility really seriously.

Have you ever seen anything like that?

Ben Walter:

I have, but it's not common. And when they said, "Yep, the price of our egg mixture went up six times and we just ate it." You weren't sitting here, but neither of them batted an eyelash. I mean, they were just like, "Okay, yep, we just ate it because we were taking the long view." Now, they have some advantages. As he said, they own their building that gives them some insulation and some other things, but still they are in it for the long haul and they're committed. I think the other thing is what they have and what that neighborhood has is they've built a business around community.

Kathleen:

And that's exactly why small businesses are so vital to cities across America. This story really is the all-American story. Just loved it.

Ben Walter:

Kathleen, thank you for joining us on this heartwarming episode on a cold wintery New York day.

Kathleen:

Yeah. The only thing that would've made it better would've been to have had a plate of pasta in front of both of us. Thanks for having me.

Ben Walter:

A plate of pasta always makes it better. I want to close by asking you each to answer one question for me. If you had one piece of advice for current or aspiring small business owner, what would it be?

Christopher Borgatti Sr.:

I always think of commitment, being committed to the business. You have to be there and have a passion for it. Don't set up a business where you're not going to be there. You got to be involved, you got to be committed.

Ben Walter:

Chris Jr.

Christopher Borgatti Jr.:

Learn from those who came before you. I learned a lot through my dad and he learned a lot through his grandparents, and they have such wisdom to pass down to me, whether it's how to make a good pasta dough, how to fix a machine, how to keep your employees happy and well-loved and them love you back. Those are things that you can't learn in a textbook. So learn from your elders, learn from those who came before you. And the minute you think you know everything, forget it.

Christopher Borgatti Sr.:

Was that one work?

Christopher Borgatti Jr.:

Yeah.

Christopher Borgatti Sr.:

I love it.

Ben Walter:

This was terrific. Chris and Chris, it's been an honor to meet you.

Christopher Borgatti Sr.:

Oh, pleasure.

Ben Walter:

I can't wait to come by the shop.

Christopher Borgatti Jr.:

Oh, definitely.

Ben Walter:

So thank you very much.

Christopher Borgatti Jr.:

Thank you, Ben.

Christopher Borgatti Sr.:

Thank you, Ben.

Ben Walter:

Thanks so much for listening to this episode of The Unshakeables. If you liked this episode, please rate and review it. Next time, we'll be speaking to another second generation business owner, but one who took the name of his father's horse racing company to make luxury apparel.

Speaker 1:

He thinks it's all crazy. He was one of the first doubters, like who's going to wear a Siegelman Stable Hat.

Ben Walter:

I'm Ben Walter, and this is The Unshakeables from Chase for Business and Ruby Studio from iHeartMedia. We'll see you back here soon.